Just to keep the mortals in the loop, This date to day, on Tuesday the 13th of August 2002, Theo had another fit ------ snip ---- snip ---- So Theo shut down all machines in his basement and none of the developers had any access to the work they doing. I'd like to remind people that at this point we lost valuable developers like Niels Provos which turns out the be one of the few who fully understood crypto and the security improvements like separation of privileges. Not to forget Hugh, Aaron and a few others.... Others had their account re-enabled after groveling. And all that over a misunderstanding that is to blame to the fact that Theo had no written procedures on how to deal with 'issues'. When Theo is away, you just 'wing it'. Today, we see the same shit all over again... Theo just announced the following: ----- snip ---- snip ---- And he picks on a few individuals: ----- snip ---- snip ---- And now he comes up with this brilliant gem: ----- snip ---- snip ---- Yes Theo, let's just go that road and you'll find yourself again in a same spot as 8 years ago: wondering why everybody started bailing out on you. Not all of us accept not that you are doing the right thing, so we'll find another sand box to play in. Enough of the bullshit... when is this project grow up and be run by a team that is accountable (voted for?) and not a guy sitting in his livingroom in his underwear ranting on ICB? H.
This appears to be none of my business, not sure how it got to misc, besides someone's deep enough interest to create a special gmail (in eu) account. Now I don't develop software, nor know anything, but this reads like the tree got locked because lots of testing was failing to occur, which sounds like a reasonable response to discovering lackluster/incomplete testing, but it's tone is much more like we're outing to the community some monster, I don't think I'm getting that from it. More like whining from someone who didn't get told exactly what they wanted to hear. I appreciate all the hard work and socially unpleasant work that goes into protecting my OS, thanks for all the effort. On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 12:46 PM, disgrun tled-developers < -- /"\ ASCII Ribbon Campaign \ / Respect for low technology. X Keep e-mail messages readable by any computer system. / \ Keep it ASCII.
One, or more, of the developers have chosen to take a selection of the There are a series of internal discussions going on regarding testing specifically during the release cycle. If anything, the strong reactions and conversations are a testament to our drive to do things right. Everyone involved in the project has high expectations for their work as well as their fellow developers. That's particularly apparent here. Please keep in mind, this is just my assessment of what's going on. I'm still a newbie dev and quite possibly naive.
I had to think a while before daring to reply to this as I'm obviously out of my depth and don't know the background or real issues or if what I have to say is remotely relevent, I apologise if I'm out of order. It seems that OpenBSD has set it's goals and is the best at it. It doesn't really need to compete with other OS. I imagine this takes overseers like theo who understand so much of the OS to point things out, as I have seen from the src list. If development accelerates then those overseers are going to have more work and pressure, and so making their/his job as easy as possible is paramount if we want any acceleration in development. I don't want to see large company syndrome, where the head doesn't know what the feet are kicking. If others think they can do his job then they are the best people to make his job and life easier resulting in faster yet still manageable development. If you develop hardware brilliantly you may not have to test test test as suggested to us by other companies, but you always have to test. On Fri, 13 Aug 2010 13:23:28 -0500
# # Bought 4.6 CD set to replace my MacroHard dying machine. # Bought 4.7 CD set and a bunch of books from store to learn the ropes. # I am a very slow learner, but have the luxury of time for now. # Went to BSDCan 2010, to realize I was one of the few with a laptop # running OpenBSD, most of the others on their MacPro silver cans. # Went to Linux Conference in Ottawa to realize again I was one of the # few with a laptop running OpenBSD, most of the others on their # HP running God knows. # I am hoping to get invited to the Hackathon when I turn 100 years old # so I can claim to be the oldest OpenBSD user on the planet. # Like weather, after a storm (or rain drops), the sun always shines. # Version 1.0 --- CF
All I can say is: "Thank you Theo for giving a damn and not running some kind of peewee flophouse." -- Monty Brandenberg
On Fri, 13 Aug 2010 19:46:24 +0200 This is between Theo and his developers. It has no place here on misc@ so please just shove it. Go cry on your mothers' shoulder and tell her all about how you got your feelings hurt. It's really fucked up what you just did.
And for those who wish to know how I came up with this: here is an email response from the culprit: <email> Nope, nothing to do with that... we all still have our commit bit and in two weeks we'll be committing to the tree again... just like you... unless of course you did not do your testing home work.... </email> -- SNIP SNIP SNIP I CAN SNIP TOO -- Well, tinyurl redirects to my box which redirects to trollaxer. Here is the culprit log for falling for such a silly trick. 188.8.131.52 - - [15/Aug/2010:19:13:12 -0400] "GET /why.html HTTP/1.1" 200 136 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; OpenBSD i386; en-US; rv:184.108.40.206) Gecko/2009070118 Firefox/3.0.11" # host kd85.com kd85.com has address 220.127.116.11 # cat why.html <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="refresh" content="0;url=http://www.trollaxor.com/2010/06/why-i-left-openbsd.html" /> </head>
I was at first *very* confused by how some information was implied but not stated in David's email. The mixed top/bottom posting order also confused me. I'd like to rephrase what David wrote, for the record -- just in case others might be as confused as I was: 1. David privately replied to the firstname.lastname@example.org email address in response to the email that started this thread. As can also be seen at http://preview.tinyurl.com/2uhlqpy , this tinyurl.com redirect in turn redirects to http://www.mindcry.org/why.html -- which David created and at that point hadn't told anyone else about. Mindcry.org is David's own web site. He set up that why.html page to in turn immediately redirect to So by making the "disgruntled.developers" sender go to mindcry.org first instead of right to trollaxor.com, David could see in his HTTP server logs what IP address the "disgruntled" person had. And by using tinyurl.com, David could hide the fact that his site was involved at all. Tinyurl.com is often used to shorten URLs that get included in emails (to avoid line breaks breaking the URL). So the use of tinyurl.com seemed innocuous, and David correctly figured that Mr. "disgruntled" would be more likely to click on a tinyurl.com link than on one that's obviously from his own domain. 3. 4. If you do whois 18.104.22.168 , you can see that this is Belgium. On a 5. David also received the following response from the email@example.com email address after he sent his bait email. The response --probably correctly-- said that Mr. "disgruntled" (i.e. Wim Vandeputte) had nothing to do with the trollaxor.com site. Of course, linking Mr. "disgruntled" (Wim) to trollaxor.com was never the point. That was just the bait, in order to identify Mr. "disgruntled". =============================================================== PS: What I personally found really annoying/insidious about the "disgruntled.developers" email that started this thread ...
Hi, I ordered mine some days ago on tekmote.nl which seems to be the (official) european distributor and has the same price. Regards, Jvrg
Hi, Nothing to do with the previous thread, but this is something that always annoys me a bit in the following syntax. I'm sure most people are aware about that, but I thought I'd hammer the nail once more. The proper way to do redirection is via the HTTP 30x status codes. This is easily done e.g., with httpd in a .htaccess (or other configuration) file as Redirect /why.html http://www.trollaxor.com/2010/06/why-i-left-openbsd.html Though it works with standard (i.e. quite likely all) clients, it loses the semantics of the redirection at the HTTP level and moves it into the contents of the page, which is not quite right . The refresh META should only be used to, unsurprisingly, refresh the current page at a given frequency. The only thing thus rendered impossible is a redirection to another page after a given period. But I have troubles coming up with a scenario requiring it which couldn't be handled in other ways. Just thought I'd rant about it (;  http://www.w3.org/QA/Tips/reback -- Olivier Mehani <firstname.lastname@example.org> PGP fingerprint: 4435 CF6A 7C8D DD9B E2DE F5F9 F012 A6E2 98C6 6655 [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature]
Nicely done David - I'm very impressed - as you know I mentioned before this on hackers that this sounded very kd85 like - and you confirmed my suspicions very effectively. Any time I see someone talking about "commit bits" I think of this and laugh - as this is someone who has never done a commit to OpenBSD. The lies in the message that was sent are pretty good to - Were we in the middle of a release cycle - were people cranky? Yes, absolutely - you know what - sane people have disagreements - all the time. however. Machines were not turned off. Everyone still had access to what they were doing Was the tree locked? yes - as problems have been found in test and need to be fixed. It's still locked - but we'll ship a good release for that. The priceless one is how the wim calls for a "vote" - yeah - that works real well for netbsd. and is also signing his messages "H" and "R" to decieve people as to the real identity and to foster suspicion within the community I find that particularly reprehensible - but not surprising. Nothing could surpirse me from this source anymore. I get the impression that this sort of behaviour is normal from Wim - it seems to make the same amount of sense as kd85's normal business practices - Sorry I can't go along with that. I pay my taxes, and I pay for my own house with my own money. I encourage Wim to fork his own project that will be run and funded fully, and openly, and accountable to all involved. I'm sure it will be a resounding success.
Will someone warn me 2 minutes before Theo gets back? I'd like to have some popcorn ready. :-)
Theo has been back for a day already. and like the rest of a lot of us, is trying to get a test and release cycle out the door to ship a release - that means we have better things to do than entertain misc@ by responding to Wim's idiotic bullshit. Wanna help? go install snapshots on as many different things as you can and tell us if you see any problems. That's a much more useful activity than watching misc@ for trolls. Pop popcorn with the waste heat of all the machines you are spinning up.
Bob, at this point is it just OpenBSD itself that can be changed, or packages as well? I think the former. --STeve Andre'
Unless testing is done and problems found, nothing will be changed. :-) .... Ken
You should have finished the job by redirecting to the goatse.cx guy :)
Wow... just wow... that is slick and *so* simple! Just like OpenBSD. So you sent that tinyurl link to the email account created by the imaginary, anonymous, disgruntled OpenBSD developers and the person who created the account *actually* clicked on the link. Has he never heard of tor. I think it's in ports. Sincerely,
Tor doesn't magically fix this problem. There is a lot more shit which can give you away.
Absolutely, the U.S. Navy will know precisely where you are if you use TOR, but no one else will. Sincerely, IR
I meant that your IP address isn't the only thing you should try to hide. There are a lot of very noisy protocols which can give your location or identity away.
wim should be happy that nobody decided to bring charges against him in .be over the disputed 'donation' funds he clearly misappropriated over the last several years. and seriously, who cares or is surprised if theo does crazy shit? there
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