Ok why write a long text and the only reason you have is that you are unhappy with driver support and with Theo? I was looking for some more indepth discussion on why you choose not to use OpenBSD anymore but it was just another worthless post. This feels more like the usual troll post of people that got hurt while dealing with Theo. Like somebody said, is this the year of trolls?
Man, it's not me. Just wanted to share that with you all.
And you felt it was something unique and new about this information so you had to write a blog post about it? Theo has been critized about this for years and I think he has heard that before. So my question remains, what was the purpose of writing it?
Dexter, I'm still relatively new to OpenBSD and the community, however a few days ago you had asked about why large memory support still wasn't enabled by default. Asking if the developers needed hardware, funding or what not to get it working properly. If you were in fact a developer as your latest rant states and large memory was such a concern for you, it would stand to reason that you would be well aware of why it hasn't made it into the default install. Also, a developer likely wouldn't piss and moan about it on the mailing lists, rather they would just start working to rectify the situation. Your obviously full of shit IMO, FreeBSD 7.2 came out quite some time ago. If you havent been using OpenBSD since your change than why did you inquire about large memory support three days ago?
What a waste of bytes.. Which planet did you come from? Well, at least, are you able to read?
On Thu, 10 Jun 2010 13:09:20 +0300 Ad-hominem crapola ==> 0 credibility. QED
> Man, it's not me. Just wanted to share that with you all. Like a dick in a pudding. You may want to share it with us all but no-one else wants you to. Meaning of words is what's important and from what I've seen, theo meant very little which you have taken to heart. From the few examples I've seen, I see YOU Dexter as the abuser whether being polite or not. I was going to comment about some of your comments on driver robustness but I fear that will waste everyones time by feeding the trolls too much.
It's always funny when somebody ends up "leaving for their own good", that they need to write a lot about it and try to convince many others to agree with their notions. Develop/use whatever you want - there are pros and cons to every open source project out there. You can fault find with Theo, or Stallman, or anyone else. But these individuals don't matter so much as overall project usefulness, licensing/openness, etc. What matters is simply that you find something you feel rewarding to work on. There is absolutely no reason to try to drag others along with you. For someone critical of Theo running other developers off, you sure seem to be trying to do the same thing with your post and by sharing it here. Think before you rant, -- Casey Allen Shobe email@example.com
IGNORE THIS, otherwise you are feeding the Trolls, hell the word troll is in the URL.
LOL! and in the last day, god said: "DON'T FEED THE TROLLS!"
I AM truly amazed, "people can't read" is indeed a fact.
Agree he's a troll by name and by actions. He is praising and switched to FreeBSD according to this post. Yet in his other post (http://www.trollaxor.com/2010/06/why-i-almost-gave-openbsd-100000-didnt.html) he states he decided to donate $100,000 to NetBSD? Makes no sense. -- Ted
you really went and read that link? cool :-) --Siju
I think that author is really big professional lier and troll. Or so stupid that it's not possible in this cosmos :D So first he wrote how he left OpenBSD because of this and this a and this, now after couple of days he wrote another post where he attacks against OpenBSD and says that after long research he decided to give some money to NetBSD. And theeeeeen.... 6 months before this post....voila http://www.trollaxor.com/2009/12/netbsd-bankrupt-software-distribution.html . So I think that only man here with need for psychiatrist is author of that posts/blog or maybe it's very sophisticated way of attack against BSDs from outside or maybe just someone needs to collect someones opinions, nicknames, IPs and so on.
Yes, Theo is an asshole. Let me cut my own throat to prove I'm a good guy!. Yea!! BTW, Theo *IS* an asshole. Most geniuses are ... On Thu, 10 Jun 2010 11:28 +0300, "Dexter Tomisson"
I was hoping for some interesting arguments But there was just whining about Theo's personality (with which I don't agree) and lack of some drivers (blobs - no thank you)
Why? What can possibly be said that will change anything? The poster is free to use what he wishes. His rant doesn't do anything useful, quite aside from the fact that statements in it aren't really true, and contains at least one legally actionable statement. --STeve Andre'
I have to disagree with you. I believe Mr. de Raadt is misunderstood. He may have a quick wit, a sharp tongue, and is obviously a driven individual. He may very well be abrasive and difficult to talk to, but if he were an asshole, he would be somebody like Bill Gates (satan). I say this because I have to cope with A.D.D. and I come off to some as an asshole when my intent is the opposite. My opinions about life and people are very different from what most people think. After learning more about OpenBSD, this project, and Mr. de Raadt, I wouldn't change a thing. If he were an agreeable person, he would not have accomplished this much. Sometimes being the "Nice Guy" just means your a doormat for everyone else. Assholes take advantage of other people. Mr. de Raadt has created a free, functional, and secure operating system for anyone to freely use, and doesn't manipulate markets to make a boat load of cash from some haphazardly manufactured product. Being that 95% to 99% of us on this list don't know Mr. de Raadt personally, I don't think we need to worry if he is going to hurt our feelings. We only need him to continue to do what he does best.
On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 11:24, Michael R. Littlejohn <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote: blah blah blah... my opinion matters. I want to zombie a troll thread... Seriously dude.
Nevertheless, this list is open and available for anyone to comment. If my previous statements are unwarranted, then perhaps you should explain your child like response. I was merely defending the character of a person that I admire. I hope he continues his work despite his detractors, and despite the likes of you who shifts the bell curve to the 60 percentile range. I really don't care if the thread is old, get over yourself and learn to have an adult and intelligent conversation. "blah blah blah", and "Seriously dude."? I thought that with the type of operating system that OpenBSD is, I would expect mostly professional users. I didn't post to the list looking for an argument. I was offering a friendly different point of view. I apologize if I have offended anyone, but I don't see how anyone could be offended, unless you are trying very hard to be.
On 21 July 2010 20:25, Michael R. Littlejohn Hmm, looks like ... Blah blah blah blah blah blah, seriously no one cares about what you think.
You did post a reply.
On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 6:25 PM, Michael R. Littlejohn Not Of Sound MInd, It's not that most don't appreciate a defense of "the almighty." It's just that such a defense is not needed. "HE" is "perfect" and can do no "wrong" (given that this is an open source project that nobody has to particpate in it). Nobody will dispute your position, as an opinion maker . . . but, as you may have noticed, through the years, that making such opinions open to this list only adds to the sarcasm/hatred. I've defenitely made myself vulnerable to such abuse (this is probably a case in point). In the end, the use of "dude" does not make the comment less sophistocated, but disapproval of such a comment only admits the lack of sophistocation on the part of s/he who took offense. Peace and may "GOD" bless America (oh . . and OpenBSD).
Even though I don't agree with you -- since the man threatened me with violence after a very thoughtful remark: On the matter of GPL/BSD license preference I suggested to respect each others opinion instead of verbally insulting one another. -- I do appreciate your attempt to have a sane conversation and retionalisation. I suggest ignoring the ignorant. # Han
hahahahahaha, slander? Hilarious either way. -- Samuel Baldwin - logik.li
On Thu, Jun 10, 2010 at 8:28 PM, Samuel Baldwin Haha, keyboard remapping abuse! That was the most hilarious part of the whole post, indeed. One time, I E-Mailed Richard Stallman about a fetchmail question, and he hacked into my box and deleted everything not GPL-licensed! Cheers, -- Casey Allen Shobe email@example.com
Please, someone do an image macro. "I'm in ur router, remappin' yar keyz"
See? Seen on the internet in TWO places now, it MUST BE TRUE! Nick.
IHBT... There are those that use OpenBSD for every bit of their computing experience. I do not even attempt to understand them. Then there are those, like myself, that use OpenBSD for a few specific tasks because doing it on OpenBSD is significantly less painful than doing it on anything else. So, OpenBSD doesn't support your new shiny hardware. If you'd used your old hardware to read the device manpages you could have picked out hardware appropriate for the task at hand. -- Chris Dukes
Why? I use OpenBSD exclusively and it works fine. Sure there are some programs that suck balls but don't blame that on OpenBSD blame that on the people who write that shit. The open source world is littered with crap and there are some gems. So that would be, like, almost everything. Sure if you need garbage like Right, so where is the problem again? You either spend the time picking your hardware or chasing howtos on how to run some random piece of shit hardware in loonocks/fleabsd/othernoncommercialos. These are all perception problems not real problems. Again, if one doesn't "need" flash one can do anything and everything on OpenBSD just fine. I am not claiming that OpenBSD should be used under all circumstances however making blanket statements that OpenBSD can't handle it is dumb.
Well, I agree up to 99%. I have been looking for a simple solution to remotely edit SQL database for years. Yes, solutions does exists, Open Office have db to, but none allow me to process, or paste multiple records at once for example. The only solution I have is to use Access with the layer ODBC on Windows to do that very quickly And yes Access is strictly use as a GUI interface if you want to edit content of SQL database on remote servers and event if that's not as fast as it might be, doing 100K paste records in that SQL DB remotely works very well and no I can't do that with Open Office and I still haven't found something to do it that way yet. Open Office allow me to edit one records at a time. Fine for many cases, but not for all. Even on a MAC I do sadly use VMWare to run Windows and have Access there as I have no alternative. Call that sad and it is. But that's one case. Only one yes, but one case where I have no alternative, or find one yet and I sure have been looking for years. All that said, for everything else yes I totally agree with you. I do not have any other case. Best, Daniel
This sounds like a very solvable problem unless it is a proprietary database.
Nope. It's just MySQL. The only proprietary software I have to run on Solaris and that I wish I could run in OpenBSD is Broadworks from Broadsoft for VoIP. But I am dreaming to be able to do that!? If you have a suggestion for the database I am all ears! (;> I even sent a few emails for ideas in the last 10 years on the subject without any success yet. This is how I do it and I sent that to MySQL list in 1999. Many users looks like use my suggestion to do the same. Works very well for everyone and is a big time savers I must admit. http://lists.mysql.com/myodbc/638 Best, Daniel
Haha odbc and mysqueel you do like pain eh? Why do you need ms access? I still don't get what the problem is.
Strictly as a GUI interface only. Liek select a row and paste huge quantity of data that customers sent to update their database, etc. All done at once and I get them most of the time in excel and sometime in Access. So, select all data, and paste in Access link to MySQL via ODBC and all is pasting all at once oppose to Open Office for example that will and can only do one row. Think of it as a quick interfcae of editing directly the database records. If oyu edit only one record, then you can do somethng else, but dong multiple one, then it's still the It's a speed of usage issue for multiple row editing. I can do quick edit directly with MySQL client in the DB, but when it comes to multiple rows entry, etc. If you get the data in either from and then try to convert in SQL statement for import and all. It takes way to much time to do it and in the end, What I do in 30 seconds would take a very long time doing it like that. It's a practical data editing and entry that it's used for. And again Access is only and strictly use for it's capability of GUI edit/paste only. And obviously I still need it to read the data I get obviously. I know the idea looks stupid. I grant you that. (;> But if you ever see it, you would see that it is darn quick and save countless hours and as time is always missing in my days, anything that same me some will be strongly consider. Plus ODBC is pretty darn old to and looks like places start to drop it's usage too. It's a very limited usage and I really do not care for any features of Access, etc. I could care less for it. As I sai,d I only and strictly use it as a GUI over ODBC to edit records directly in the remote database. Nothing else. I may not explain myself very well I agree. Sometime I have problem doing so. but that's all there is to it really. Nothing more then that. That's why it looks to stupid doing so and replacing it should be very simple. But I just do not have an alternative for it and I looked for ...
Why don't you write an import/export script? VB is painful but lends itself well for this type of activity.
Anyway, I will let the tread die. I don't think it's of any interest to anyone and I shouldn't hijack treads. Thanks Marco. I am sure it's more boring them a great OpenBSD OS for sure! I wish I have an alternative, but I don't and I live with it. Not the end of the world.
Sorry, I haven't ran adobe flash on OpenBSD, running a linux browser and linux compatibility mode always put me off as I needed it so rarely. I know others have, but I'm not sure about recently. I ran gnash a while back and it worked for upto version 7/8, but it was a bit buggy. You can still download flash videos and play them via vlc or mplayer. Now the weekly reports of adobe exploits and expectations on html5 video keep it on just a few systems. I very occasionally find sites that have a web developer follow such bad practice as to use only flash. What problem are you running into?
Not using OpenBSD for most everything is a cop-out. Means when there are problems, you don't think them. As a user, it's your privilege. For actual developers that want to make OpenBSD better, using it for most things is a good way to keep yourself honest. I find that my OS needs are such that OpenBSD is quite enough for a lot of things... yes, including a desktop OS.
Seems perfectly reasonable... I wish more Gnome developers would embrace the same thought process :-). But the thread was started by a troll that wanting OpenBSD to work on his "New Shiny" instead of trying to figure out what he wanted to do and if OpenBSD was the right tool for the job. I came upon OpenBSD due to a problem with networks. I came upon OpenBSD after the stupidity of "You can do everything from Windows 3.0. You can do everything from OS/2. You can do everything from BSD386. You can do everything from Linux. You can do everything from AIX." Unfortunately I couldn't, but boy did OpenBSD have some rather good documentation that related to the network problem I needed to solve. You develop on OpenBSD for OpenBSD and I appreciate it. You have a set of things to do where it appears you can do them all on OpenBSD. I get tossed things like java apps that can cause a machine with 24G of ram to swap itsself to death. If I were to put OpenBSD into the mix it would be to severely sanitize what can reach the java apps rather than actually try and run them. There are those that take the attitude "I'm loyal to platform X, so I must get it to run on platform X." Well, I don't understand those folks and why they don't think "How can I get management to kill off use of this app and to fire the code monkeys to blame for it?" I have teenagers and a wife that want all of the facebook and youtube shiny. I'm sure that given enough time and effort I could get all of that working under OpenBSD, it might even take less time than cleaning up a Windows box thats been to all the other malign web shiny. -- Chris Dukes
Personally I turn that on it's head Doing everything possible on OpenBSD aside from updating packages is less painful because there is less to worry about and check and because it is so stable. I use OpenBSD for almost everything that it can be used for and switch to others for the rare things it's not so good at like flash (hopefully dying), retail games, some windows software and supporting the latest tv receivers. My mates vista didn't have enough memory and was running rediculously slow, he switched to Linux and it was all good but then when running out of space due to so many auto kernel upgrades, kde wouldn't log in. His bios battery went and so when his girlfriends mum pulled the plug on his laptop at night and he booted in the morning, linux dropped to a single user shell wanting fsck -fy; exit. He found setting the date forwards sorted it and ended up at 2021 before he got it to me to have a look. If OpenBSD ran flash and was easy for him to update he wouldn't have had either of those problems. Maybe freebsd or pcbsd would have suited him. I'm not sure.
Sorta messed up there For the record I know OpenBSD can run flash but I choose not to taint my OpenBSD boxes with it and linux code and boot something
Maybe I'm getting on a bit, but I don't consider swapping operating system to be the best option in that case. Vista may be a memory hog, but it's usually easier in the long run to spend cash on 4GB for a laptop, than to install and faff around with a whole new operating system.. Linux running out of space due to kernel upgrades is obviously a configuration (hard disk partitioning) problem. Obviously I prefer BSD Unix to Linux, but the evidence does suggest the wrong Linux distribution was being used.
I did suggest more memory, but he was hard for cash at the time and vista was doing some stupid things anyway and it was so slow, taking 20 mins to boot that it was very difficult to speed up or fix because it took so long to do ANYTHING. He actually got an extra gig of memory yesterday and it has helped a lot. He is happy with Linux apart from openoffice or rather the microsoft office lack of compatibility and said he will still use it for the internet and most things and boot vista for using excel and a couple of other things. The space problem was because I had squeezed it onto his hard drive, the point is Linux developers seem to do some stupid things like putting rc files all over the place, now upstarts come along. Locking down init/rc on OpenBSD takes a fair few files but on Linux you may as well forget it. Finding the fsck is easy on OpenBSD, even though I've found it before it's simply a pain to find on Linux, for no reason, of course slackware is better, but not really so suited for a Windows user. Windows is even worse try tracking down driver registry start ups. There's many problems that could easily be prevented like the time/fsck and kernel management, kde needing space. These are just some of the ones I know about. OpenBSD takes the filesystem time when it is newer and just boots and the kernel isn't full of exploits and is always likely to work. OpenBSD thinking things through and doing things correctly is why I am so content with OpenBSD, especially when most people most of the time use so little of an operating system. On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 01:28:07 +0100
Since for some reason this thread is still here, I will copy and paste what I believe to be the most relevant text on either of those pages. It is duplicated on both, but I will only quote it once. Disclaimer This site contains works of fiction. If you don't realize that you're reading fiction, you shouldn't be here. l8rZ, -- andrew - ICQ# 253198 - Jabber: firstname.lastname@example.org - Twitter: @AFreshOne BOFH excuse of the day: Our POP server was kidnapped by a weasel.
|Paul Turner||[tg_shares_up rewrite v4 11/11] sched: update tg->shares after cpu.shares write|
|Mr. James W. Laferriere||Re: Linux 2.6.25-rc1 , syntax error near unexpected token `;'|
|Chuck Ebbert||Re: PCI: Unable to reserve mem region problem|
|Mingming Cao||Re: [RFC 1/4] Large Blocksize support for Ext2/3/4|
|Linus Torvalds||Linux 2.6.34-rc4|
|Ralf Wildenhues||[PATCH] Fix typos in the documentation|
|Adeodato||Bazaar's patience diff as GIT_EXTERNAL_DIFF|
|Johannes Schindelin||Re: [PATCH 2/4] Add functions get_relative_cwd() and is_inside_dir()|
|Len Brown||Re: fatal: unable to create '.git/index': File exists|
|Denis Bueno||Git clone error|
|Linux Kernel Mailing List||ASoC: fix registration of the SoC card in the Freescale MPC8610 drivers|
|Linux Kernel Mailing List||drivers/acpi: use kasprintf|
|Linux Kernel Mailing List||nfsd41: sanity check client drc maxreqs|
|Linux Kernel Mailing List||bnx2x: Moving includes|
|Linux Kernel Mailing List||V4L/DVB: gspca - sonixj: Adjust minor values of sensor ov7630. - set the color ga...|
|Sevan / Venture37||Re: This is what Linus Torvalds calls openBSD crowd|
|Netmaffia.hu||Tini Lányok AKCIÓBAN OTTHON|
|Sam Fourman Jr.||Re: Help with Altell PC6700|
|Siju George||This is what Linus Torvalds calls openBSD crowd|
|Darrin Chandler||Re: OT: Python (was Re: vi in /bin)|
|Kurt Van Dijck||Re: [PATCH net-next-2.6 1/2] can: add driver for Softing card|
|Eric Dumazet||Re: [PATCH net-next-2.6] net: Introduce skb_orphan_try()|
|Jamie Lokier||Re: POHMELFS high performance network filesystem. Transactions, failover, performa...|
|David Miller||Re: [PATCH v2] net: typos in comments in include/linux/igmp.h|
|Ursula Braun||[patch 0/1] remove header_ops bug in qeth driver|