Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies

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To: Adrian Bunk <bunk@...>
Cc: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@...>, Andrew Morton <akpm@...>, Rafael J. Wysocki <rjw@...>, <davem@...>, <linux-kernel@...>, <jirislaby@...>, Steven Rostedt <rostedt@...>
Date: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 - 3:03 am

On Thu, 1 May 2008 03:31:25 +0300
Adrian Bunk <bunk@kernel.org> wrote:


I would argue instead that we don't know which bugs to fix first.
We're never going to fix all bugs, and to be honest, that's ok.
As long as we fix the important bugs, we're doing really well.
And at least for the kerneloops.org reported issues, we're doing quite ok.

For me, 'important' is a combination of effect of the bug and the number of people
it'll hit. A compiler warning on parisc is less important than easy to trigger filesystem corruption
in ext3 that way; more people will hit it and the effect is more grave.


For oopses and WARN_ON()'s were getting to the hang of this now with kerneloops.org,
at least for the oopses that aren't really hard fatal. One thing I learned at least is that
lkml is a poor representation of what people actually hit; it's a very very selective
audience. 
oopses/warnons are only a subset of the bugs of course... but still.

So there's a few things we (and you / janitors) can do over time to get better data on what issues
people hit: 
1) Get automated collection of issues more wide spread. The wider our net the better we know which
   issues get hit a lot, and plain the more data we have on when things start, when they stop, etc etc.
   Especially if you get a lot of testers in your project, I'd like them to install the client for easy reporting
   of issues.
2) We should add more WARN_ON()s on "known bad" conditions. If it WARN_ON()'s, we can learn about it via
   the automated collection. And we can then do the statistics to figure out which ones happen a lot.
3) We need to get persistent-across-reboot oops saving going; there's some venues for this


--
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Messages in current thread:
Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Tue Apr 29, 10:03 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 3:36 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 4:15 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 4:31 pm)
RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Wed Apr 30, 8:31 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Arjan van de Ven, (Wed Apr 30, 3:03 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Thu May 1, 7:30 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Arjan van de Ven, (Wed Apr 30, 10:20 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Thu May 1, 9:21 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Paul Mackerras, (Thu May 1, 10:08 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Josh Boyer, (Thu May 1, 11:10 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Paul Mackerras, (Fri May 2, 12:09 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Fri May 2, 4:29 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Linus Torvalds, (Fri May 2, 10:58 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Carlos R. Mafra, (Fri May 2, 11:44 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Linus Torvalds, (Fri May 2, 12:28 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Carlos R. Mafra, (Fri May 2, 1:15 pm)
RE: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Pallipadi, Venkatesh, (Fri May 2, 2:02 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Carlos R. Mafra, (Fri May 9, 3:30 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Paul Mackerras, (Fri May 2, 6:16 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Fri May 2, 7:58 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Andrew Morton, (Thu May 1, 11:49 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Arjan van de Ven, (Wed Apr 30, 9:13 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Fri May 2, 5:00 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Theodore Tso, (Thu May 1, 1:24 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Andrew Morton, (Thu May 1, 3:26 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Steven Rostedt, (Thu May 1, 3:39 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Steven Rostedt, (Thu May 1, 12:38 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Andrew Morton, (Thu May 1, 1:18 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 8:53 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Andrew Morton, (Thu May 1, 4:13 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Arjan van de Ven, (Wed Apr 30, 10:15 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Rene Herman, (Sun May 4, 8:45 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Pekka Enberg, (Sun May 4, 9:00 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Rene Herman, (Sun May 4, 9:19 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, David Woodhouse, (Thu May 1, 8:42 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Benny Halevy, (Mon May 5, 6:03 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Arjan van de Ven, (Wed Apr 30, 11:02 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Enrico Weigelt, (Thu May 1, 6:30 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Thu May 1, 9:02 am)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, David Miller, (Wed Apr 30, 8:41 pm)
Re: RFC: starting a kernel-testers group for newbies, Adrian Bunk, (Thu May 1, 9:23 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, H. Peter Anvin, (Wed Apr 30, 5:52 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Thu May 1, 12:39 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Bob Tracy, (Wed Apr 30, 11:24 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 4:54 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jiri Kosina, (Fri May 9, 5:28 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jeff Garzik, (Fri May 9, 11:00 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Dmitri Vorobiev, (Wed Apr 30, 5:42 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 6:10 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jan Engelhardt, (Thu May 1, 2:15 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Dmitri Vorobiev, (Wed Apr 30, 7:04 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 6:19 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Kevin Winchester, (Thu May 1, 7:06 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Dmitri Vorobiev, (Wed Apr 30, 6:28 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Diego Calleja, (Thu May 1, 12:26 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Stephen Rothwell, (Thu May 1, 9:48 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Dmitri Vorobiev, (Thu May 1, 12:31 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jiri Slaby, (Wed Apr 30, 6:06 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Wed Apr 30, 5:21 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Helge Hafting, (Fri May 2, 9:37 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Ingo Molnar, (Wed Apr 30, 6:19 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rusty Russell, (Sun May 4, 11:04 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Ingo Molnar, (Wed Apr 30, 6:35 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Wed Apr 30, 6:51 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Adrian Bunk, (Wed Apr 30, 10:48 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Ingo Molnar, (Wed Apr 30, 9:40 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 6:49 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Wed Apr 30, 6:22 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 6:39 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Wed Apr 30, 7:12 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Chris Shoemaker, (Wed Apr 30, 8:15 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 1:09 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 7:59 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Wed Apr 30, 6:54 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Dmitri Vorobiev, (Wed Apr 30, 6:02 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 5:47 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Dan Noe, (Wed Apr 30, 4:47 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 4:59 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Mariusz Kozlowski, (Wed Apr 30, 6:53 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andi Kleen, (Fri May 2, 6:20 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Mariusz Kozlowski, (Fri May 2, 11:33 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 7:11 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Ben Dooks, (Mon May 12, 5:27 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 5:30 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 6:08 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 5:37 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 4:05 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Paul Mackerras, (Wed Apr 30, 7:29 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 11:47 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jeff Garzik, (Thu May 1, 12:17 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Alan Cox, (Thu May 1, 5:17 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Thu May 1, 12:46 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Krzysztof Halasa, (Sun May 4, 9:47 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jacek Luczak, (Sun May 4, 11:05 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jeff Garzik, (Wed Apr 30, 9:57 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Frans Pop, (Wed Apr 30, 10:52 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 4:45 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Stefan Richter, (Thu May 1, 9:54 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 10:06 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 5:37 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 6:23 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Wed Apr 30, 6:40 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 7:45 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Adrian Bunk, (Wed Apr 30, 8:38 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 8:56 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Adrian Bunk, (Wed Apr 30, 9:25 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 8:05 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Wed Apr 30, 7:57 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Chris Shoemaker, (Wed Apr 30, 8:01 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Wed Apr 30, 8:14 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 8:38 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jeremy Fitzhardinge, (Wed Apr 30, 9:39 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 6:31 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 7:03 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Wed Apr 30, 6:46 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 7:20 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Jeremy Fitzhardinge, (Wed Apr 30, 9:30 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 1:35 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 8:42 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 9:19 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 1:50 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 7:53 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Thu May 1, 3:36 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz..., (Thu May 1, 9:16 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Ray Lee, (Thu May 1, 11:29 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 3:03 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 9:53 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz..., (Thu May 1, 10:35 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Will Newton, (Thu May 1, 8:11 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 9:40 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 7:38 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Arjan van de Ven, (Wed Apr 30, 10:28 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 8:41 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Arjan van de Ven, (Wed Apr 30, 11:06 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Frans Pop, (Wed Apr 30, 11:53 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Nigel Cunningham, (Wed Apr 30, 10:31 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Stephen Clark, (Thu May 1, 2:32 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Al Viro, (Wed Apr 30, 10:21 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rene Herman, (Sat May 3, 11:26 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Thu May 1, 1:19 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Wed Apr 30, 9:51 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 10:01 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Wed Apr 30, 10:17 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 9:31 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 9:43 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 6:59 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Thu May 1, 11:26 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Chris Frey, (Thu May 1, 2:35 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Enrico Weigelt, (Fri May 2, 9:22 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 1:09 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Thu May 1, 1:41 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 5:59 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Stefan Richter, (Fri May 2, 8:17 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Friedrich , (Thu May 1, 3:39 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 2:50 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Thu May 1, 6:17 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Thu May 1, 3:07 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 3:28 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Thu May 1, 3:46 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 3:53 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Al Viro, (Thu May 1, 2:11 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Thu May 1, 2:23 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Al Viro, (Thu May 1, 3:37 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Joel Becker, (Thu May 1, 4:07 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Thu May 1, 3:58 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Thu May 1, 2:58 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Thu May 1, 2:30 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 6:52 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Willy Tarreau, (Wed Apr 30, 7:21 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Chris Shoemaker, (Wed Apr 30, 7:38 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 6:41 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Tarkan Erimer, (Thu May 1, 8:31 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Stefan Richter, (Thu May 1, 11:34 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Tarkan Erimer, (Fri May 2, 10:05 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Adrian Bunk, (Wed Apr 30, 8:57 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Theodore Tso, (Wed Apr 30, 9:35 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 9:25 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Adrian Bunk, (Wed Apr 30, 10:13 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 10:30 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Pavel Machek, (Wed May 14, 10:55 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Adrian Bunk, (Thu May 1, 2:54 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 7:23 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Wed Apr 30, 7:41 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 7:51 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 4:14 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Greg KH, (Wed Apr 30, 7:34 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 4:56 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Andrew Morton, (Wed Apr 30, 4:00 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Rafael J. Wysocki, (Wed Apr 30, 4:20 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Peter Teoh, (Wed Apr 30, 10:48 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Wed Apr 30, 12:03 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Tarkan Erimer, (Wed Apr 30, 3:11 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Wed Apr 30, 9:28 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, , (Wed Apr 30, 10:41 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Mike Galbraith, (Wed Apr 30, 9:38 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Wed Apr 30, 12:18 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Wed Apr 30, 9:04 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 10:51 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Wed Apr 30, 2:21 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 2:27 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Chris Friesen, (Wed Apr 30, 3:06 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 3:13 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Wed Apr 30, 3:22 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 3:42 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Wed Apr 30, 2:55 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 3:08 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Wed Apr 30, 3:16 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Apr 30, 3:25 pm)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Newall, (Thu May 1, 12:31 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Kasper Sandberg, (Thu May 1, 11:28 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Lennart Sorensen, (Thu May 1, 9:49 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, David Miller, (Thu May 1, 12:37 am)
Re: Slow DOWN, please!!!, Michael Kerrisk, (Wed Apr 30, 9:18 am)