On 22/01/08 22:15 +0100, Willy Tarreau wrote:
quoted text
> On Tue, Jan 22, 2008 at 02:08:58PM -0700, Jordan Crouse wrote:
> > On 22/01/08 21:15 +0100, Willy Tarreau wrote:
> > > So it seems like applying the workaround on top of TinyBIOS 0.98 undoes
> > > this BIOS's workaround. I'm now wondering how we could detect whether
> > > the workaround was applied or not :-/
> > 
> > Actually, the TinyBIOS "workaround" is the same thing.
> > 
> > Like I may have said before, there is a reason why this MSR is undocumented.
> > It works, but the behavior is unvalidated, and obviously erratic.  When we
> > first developed this code, we were using the Geode GX on the OLPC with VSA,
> > so using the MSR was nessesary if we wanted to get our hands on any 
> > timers at all.  Mitch Bradley (author of OpenFirmware) determined through
> > testing that the MSR was erratic, especially when you ran it when all the
> > timers were already clear.  I suspect thats the problem that we see here -
> > writing the MSR in TinyBIOS unstablizied the registers, and writing the
> > MSR again kicked it back.  Of course, the unfortunate corollary is that
> > when the workaround isn't in v0.99, if you run the MSR in the kernel, then
> > you will end up destabilizing everything.
> 
> Indeed, that looks exactly like what's happening.
> 
> > Furthermore, using the MSR is okay with TinyBIOS, but not okay with the
> > other Geode BIOSen (Insyde, General Software, and for the moment LinuxBIOS)
> > because VSA (the SMM handler) _does_ use some of the timers.  So needless
> > to say, I'm concerned.
> 
> I certainly can understand.
> 
> > > Interestingly, during the boot, I got thousands of the following line :
> > > geode_mfgpt: reading 0x6200 + 0x6 + (0x0 * 8) = 0x6206                          
> > > It's a debug line I added in geode_mfgpt_read() which writes the timer and
> > > reg being read. It slowed the boot down due to being written to a serial
> > > console, but fortunately stopped when syslogd had changed the console log
> > > level. Just checking...
> > 
> > We control the timer and the status bits for the timer in the setup 
> > register, which is what you are showing above.  Thats fine.
> 
> OK.
> 
> > > # grep mfgpt /proc/interrupts;sleep 10;grep mfgpt /proc/interrupts
> > >   7:      82320    XT-PIC-XT        mfgpt-timer
> > >   7:      84882    XT-PIC-XT        mfgpt-timer
> > > 
> > > It delivers 256 IRQs/s. That makes me think about this comment in mfgpt_32.c :
> > 
> > Hmm - are you running with nohz?
> 
> No but I have CONFIG_HZ=250. That makes sense then :
> 
> #define MFGPT_HZ  (32000 / MFGPT_DIVISOR)
> #define MFGPT_PERIODIC (MFGPT_HZ / HZ)
> 
> => MFGPT_PERIODIC = (32000 / 16) / 250 = 8
> Given that it's 32.768 kHz in fact, we get 32768/16/8 = 256 Hz
> 
> > >  * We are using the 32Khz input clock - its the only one that has the
> > >  * ranges we find desirable.  The following table lists the suitable
> > >  * divisors and the associated hz, minimum interval
> > >  * and the maximum interval:
> > >  *
> > >  *  Divisor   Hz      Min Delta (S) Max Delta (S)
> > >  *   1        32000     .0005          2.048
> > >  *   2        16000      .001          4.096
> > >  *   4         8000      .002          8.192
> > > ...
> > > 
> > > When you say a 32kHz clock, you mean 32000 Hz. Are you really sure ? Most
> > > 32 kHz clocks everywhere are really 32768 Hz (the watch quartz). BTW, I'm
> > > seeing a 32.768 kHz xtal close to the CS5536, and the numbers above seem
> > > to support this suggestion too.
> > 
> > Hmm - yeah, my math is off there - it is a 32768 Hz clock.  That
> > shouldn't affect things too negatively - if it does we can adjust the
> > divisor we use - currently we use 16.
> 
> Why not just ajust the constant in MFGPT_HZ since it's the only place (aside
> the comments) where this is referenced ?
> 
> If you want I can send you a patch and adjust the comments at the same time.

That would be great.

quoted text
> > > So right now that I've found what caused old kernel to unexpectedly work,
> > > I'm planning a BIOS upgrade. I'm still just wondering what we can do to
> > > detect that the workaround should be needed. I suspect nothing, of course,
> > > but just in case... Maybe we can detect the effects of the workaround ?
> > 
> > I'm not sure if we can - all we can tell is if the registers are zero or
> > not.  Like I said, running the MSR is probably dangerous in 9 out of 10
> > situations, the one good use being the one you determined.  I would
> > support adding the mfgptfix bit though - just as long as it isn't 
> > automagic.
> 
> OK I perfectly understand. While I see the current behaviour as a regression
> compared to 2.6.22-mainline (since 2.6.24-rc8 does not boot off from this
> board without nomfgpt), the first problem is in the BIOS and it requires an
> upgrade. Maybe we should extend the scope of CONFIG_GEODE_MFGPT_TIMER to
> allow it to completely disable the detection logic when it's off ? I certainly
> can work a clean patch for "mfgptfix", but for users who will get caught with
> this board not booting at all anymore, adding an option in their boot loaders
> may be as problematic as upgrading the BIOS. I'm also thinking about the ones
> preparing new software updates from a recent boards and deploying them miles
> away without knowing they are running a 0.98 BIOS which will prevent their
> new kernel from booting.

I think not allowing MFGPT timers for broken BIOSen is the right way to go.
We can do  just-in-time detection the first time one of the drivers (timer
tick or watchdog) asks for a timer, instead of the current way of probing
automatically.

That way, you can go merrily on your way if you don't try to use any of
the MFGPTs.  TinyBIOS users can compile out CONFIG_GEODE_MFGPT_TIMER and
boot.

I'll write up a patch.

Thanks,
Jordan

-- 
Jordan Crouse
Systems Software Development Engineer 
Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.


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