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Re: [PATCH] Version 3 (2.6.23-rc8) Smack: Simplified Mandatory Access Control Kernel

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To: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@...>
Cc: Stephen Smalley <sds@...>, James Morris <jmorris@...>, Andrew Morton <akpm@...>, <casey@...>, <linux-security-module@...>, <linux-kernel@...>
Date: Tuesday, October 2, 2007 - 11:54 pm

Linus Torvalds wrote:

Actually I had quoted that, made a reply, and decided that my reply was 
too close to a flame and deleted the quote and the nasty reply, because 
I couldn't find a nice way to say what I wanted. Oh well, I tried to 
keep to a higher level, but... on this topic you seem to be off on an 
ego trip. You are not the decider, George Bush is the decider, and the 
only time he's not wrong he didn't understand the question. I checked 
the schedule, it's not you week to be God.

There are sensible people you respect on other topics, who have the 
opinion that there is room for behaviors other than CFS, and who have 
created a pluggable scheduler framework which they are trying to hand 
you on a platter. And you won't even consider that they might be right, 
because you believe there can be one scheduler which is close to optimal 
for all loads.

Unfortunately not so, I've been looking at schedulers since MULTICS, and 
desktops since the 70s (MP/M), and networked servers since I was the 
ARPAnet technical administrator at GE's Corporate R&D Center. And on 
desktops response is (and should be king), while on a server, like nntp 
or mail, I will happily go from 1ms to 10sec for a message to pass 
through the system if only I can pass 30% more messages per hour, 
because in virtually all cases transit time in that range is not an 
issue. Same thing for DNS, LDAP, etc, only smaller time range. If my 
goal is <10ms, I will not sacrifice capacity to do it.

Because people who run servers for a living, and have to live with 
limited hardware capacity realize that latency isn't the only issue to 
be addressed, and that the policy for degradation of latency vs. 
throughput may be very different on one server than another or a desktop.

Because people can't get you to understand that one size doesn't fit all 
(and I doubt I've broken through).

The real issue is that you can't imagine that people who don't share 
your opinion are not only wrong but don't understand the problem. You 
may be right, but when you say anyone who disagrees is wrong by 
definition, then you have lost sight of productive technical 
differences. When your arguments drop to personal attacks and rants it's 
time to look at your technical values.

Exactly, and I'm not the only one who doubts that more than one model 
would be useful. I'm sorry you can't see that about CPU schedulers as well.

I don't disagree with you lightly, in this case I think I have a better 
superficial understanding of schedulers than you do of how production 
servers are used.

-- 
bill davidsen <davidsen@tmr.com>
  CTO TMR Associates, Inc
  Doing interesting things with small computers since 1979

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Messages in current thread:
Re: [PATCH] Version 3 (2.6.23-rc8) Smack: Simplified Mandato..., Bill Davidsen, (Tue Oct 2, 11:54 pm)
Re: [PATCH] Version 3 (2.6.23-rc8) Smack: Simplified Mandato..., Eric W. Biederman, (Fri Oct 5, 12:45 am)
Re: [PATCH] Version 3 (2.6.23-rc8) Smack: Simplified Mandato..., Kazuki Omo(Company), (Tue Oct 30, 12:01 am)
Re: [PATCH] Version 3 (2.6.23-rc8) Smack: Simplified Mandato..., Eric W. Biederman, (Wed Oct 10, 9:48 am)
Re: [PATCH] Version 3 (2.6.23-rc8) Smack: Simplified Mandato..., Christoph Hellwig, (Sun Sep 30, 5:53 am)
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