Re: floating points in kernel space

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From: mohit verma
Date: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 - 5:43 am

hi all,
i read somewhere that there is no floating point arithmatic supported in the
kernel space . is it true??
but the floating point registers and even floating point arithmatic units
are all handled by the.........( kernel i think).


thanks in advance for help...........


-- 
........................
*MOHIT VERMA*
From: Victor Rodriguez
Date: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 - 7:31 am

HI it is true , the floating point is not supported on printk , AFAIK
the only way to handle is to send it like HEX values and then some
other application like perl or python transform it to floating point

Hope it helps

Regards


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From: Dave Hylands
Date: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 - 8:44 am

Hi Mohit,


That is correct. In some architectures, attempts to use floating point
from the kernel will work. I've seen some x86 code that uses it.
However, with ARM for example, there is no float support in the
kernel, and some ARM architectures have no floating point support in
the hardware either. For ARM, there is a kernel implemented emulation
of the floating point instructions, but these can only be called from
user space. There are also some ARM software floating point libraries
(aka soft-fp) which can be used from user space (which are much more
efficient than using the kernel emulation library)

The kernel also doesn't support 64-bit division using the C divide
statement, unless you happen to be running on a 64-bit architecture.
There are some helper functions to achieve 64-bit division (see
div64.h).

Dave Hylands

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From: Mulyadi Santosa
Date: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 - 9:57 am

Hi..



AFAIK, once x86 didn't supported due to floating point related
registers are not correctly (or even doing?) saved and restored during
context switching. So maybe it is fixed now...

-- 
regards,

Mulyadi Santosa
Freelance Linux trainer and consultant

blog: the-hydra.blogspot.com
training: mulyaditraining.blogspot.com

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From: julie Sullivan
Date: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 - 3:19 pm

I've often wondered about this oft-cited kernel behaviour too, in my
naivety.  I understand
that this must be on a per-arch basis, but does this mean that the kernel
doesn't police FP
access at _all_ (perhaps this is what Mohit means too)? Does code like X for
example have to access it directly, or does it just use the GPU? What about
other user-space code - does it
have a separate library and do its own security? Video drivers?
Sorry if these are basic questions, I grepped for float in the kernel but
as-yet the associated
code looks really arcane to me - if anyone could answer any of these
questions generally
(if that's possible) that would be very helpful with visualizing the
mechanism.
Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place.

When I started looking at the kernel I imagined this small, neat, concise
piece of highly
efficient code so I wasn't surprised there was no float (don't laugh - how
one learns :-/ ) ...
I suppose any float per-arch 'hacks' (to get a larger word size) would not
be worth
the overhead of the mode switch and extra code?

Thanks
Julie
From: Greg Freemyer
Date: Tuesday, January 4, 2011 - 3:32 pm

Julie,

I think the issue is the kernel is extremely concerned with the
efficiency of the syscall path.

Very legitimately some benchmarks just measure that one path to see
how many thousands of syscalls per second can be made.

To accelerate that path as much as possible, the linux kenel chooses
not to incur the overhead of preserving the FP registers on every
syscall.

So kernel code that uses FP must first ensure any registers it uses
are preserved.  I don't recall ever writing any FP kernel code, so I
don't know what facilities are available to do that.

Greg

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