Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names | KernelTrap

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names

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From: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@...>

To: Kevin Ballard <kevin@...>

Cc: Jakub Narebski <jnareb@...>, Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@...>, Mark Junker <mjscod@...>, <git@...>

Subject: Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names

Date: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 6:32 pm

On Wed, 16 Jan 2008, Kevin Ballard wrote:
quoted text> 
> It's not using different encodings, it's all Unicode. However, it accepts
> different normalization variants of Unicode, since it can read them all and it
> would be folly to require everybody to conform to its own special internal
> variant. But it does have to normalize them, otherwise how would it detect the
> same filename using different normalizations?

That's a singularly *stupid* argument.

Here, let me rephrase that same idiotic argument:

  "But it does have to uppercase them, otherwise how would it detect the 
   same filename using different cases?"

..and if you don't see how that's *exactly* the same argument, you really 
are stupid.

The fact is, normalization is wrong.

It's wrong when you normalize upper/lower case (no, the word "Polish" is 
not the same as "polish"), and it's equally wrong when you normalize for 
"looks similar".

quoted text> In other words, you're used to filenames as bytes, HFS+ treats filenames 
> as strings.

No. HFS+ treats users as idiots and thinks that it should "fix" the 
filename for them. And it causes problems.

It causes problems for exactly the same reasons case-independence causes 
problems, because it's EXACTLY THE SAME ISSUE. People may think that "but 
they are the same", but they aren't. Case matters. And so does "single 
character" vs "two character overlay". 

Does it always matter? Hell no. But the problem with a filesystem that 
thinks it knows better is that when it *sometimes* matters, the filesystem 
simply DOES THE WRONG THING.

Can't you understand that?

			Linus
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Messages in current thread:

git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mark Junker, (Wed Jan 16, 11:17 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Wed Jan 16, 11:34 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Wed Jan 16, 11:43 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Miles Bader, (Thu Jan 17, 3:29 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Wed Jan 16, 7:03 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Wed Jan 16, 12:32 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Jakub Narebski, (Wed Jan 16, 12:46 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Wed Jan 16, 4:39 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Wed Jan 16, 7:52 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Jakub Narebski, (Wed Jan 16, 5:51 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Wed Jan 16, 6:06 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Wed Jan 16, 6:23 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Wed Jan 16, 7:16 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 6:32 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 6:52 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Wed Jan 16, 7:11 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 7:38 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Wed Jan 16, 7:57 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 8:16 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Peter Karlsson, (Fri Jan 18, 4:29 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Jakub Narebski, (Fri Jan 18, 7:16 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Wed Jan 16, 8:27 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Wed Jan 16, 8:35 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Wed Jan 16, 8:45 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, David Kastrup, (Wed Jan 16, 8:32 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Wed Jan 16, 8:40 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Wed Jan 16, 8:54 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Wed Jan 16, 9:08 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 9:41 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Thu Jan 17, 12:07 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Wed Jan 16, 8:09 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 9:16 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Wed Jan 16, 11:52 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 12:08 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Thu Jan 17, 6:08 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 12:43 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, JM Ibanez, (Thu Jan 17, 6:01 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Thu Jan 17, 6:09 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Robin Rosenberg, (Thu Jan 17, 9:27 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 7:05 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Thu Jan 17, 7:10 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mark Junker, (Thu Jan 17, 2:09 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 2:42 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Thu Jan 17, 2:52 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 3:11 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Peter Karlsson, (Fri Jan 18, 6:19 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Fri Jan 18, 1:11 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Peter Karlsson, (Mon Jan 21, 10:14 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 2:16 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 12:43 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Mon Jan 21, 4:30 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 2:12 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Mon Jan 21, 4:36 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Martin Langhoff, (Mon Jan 21, 5:06 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, David Kastrup, (Mon Jan 21, 5:09 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 5:42 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Martin Langhoff, (Mon Jan 21, 6:45 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mike Hommey, (Mon Jan 21, 3:44 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 3:05 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Mon Jan 21, 4:56 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 5:07 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Mon Jan 21, 6:41 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 6:53 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Mon Jan 21, 7:21 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Theodore Tso, (Mon Jan 21, 3:57 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 4:01 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Theodore Tso, (Mon Jan 21, 4:15 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 4:31 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Theodore Tso, (Mon Jan 21, 4:46 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 4:59 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 3:41 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 3:58 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 4:33 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 4:53 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, David Kastrup, (Mon Jan 21, 4:58 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 5:33 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 5:49 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 6:34 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 6:46 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 7:44 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 8:47 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 9:01 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 9:13 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 10:33 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 10:50 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 11:04 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Martin Langhoff, (Mon Jan 21, 11:21 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Tue Jan 22, 12:22 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Mon Jan 21, 11:17 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Theodore Tso, (Mon Jan 21, 7:00 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 7:09 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Martin Langhoff, (Mon Jan 21, 6:56 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Martin Langhoff, (Mon Jan 21, 5:17 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 5:28 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Martin Langhoff, (Mon Jan 21, 5:43 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Nicolas Pitre, (Mon Jan 21, 1:08 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, David Kastrup, (Mon Jan 21, 4:32 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Mon Jan 21, 1:25 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, David Kastrup, (Mon Jan 21, 4:35 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Jeff King, (Mon Jan 21, 12:53 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Junio C Hamano, (Fri Jan 18, 4:28 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Eric W. Biederman, (Tue Jan 22, 10:46 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Junio C Hamano, (Tue Jan 22, 10:57 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Nicolas Pitre, (Wed Jan 23, 10:26 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Junio C Hamano, (Wed Jan 23, 5:19 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Fri Jan 18, 4:50 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Fri Jan 18, 4:24 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Sat Jan 19, 4:48 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Sat Jan 19, 2:58 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Sat Jan 19, 8:11 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Sat Jan 19, 9:04 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Sun Jan 20, 5:34 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mike Hommey, (Sun Jan 20, 1:27 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Sun Jan 20, 1:45 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mike Hommey, (Sun Jan 20, 3:00 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Sun Jan 20, 4:00 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Sun Jan 20, 4:12 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Sun Jan 20, 3:26 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Sat Jan 19, 6:58 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Sun Jan 20, 2:14 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Sun Jan 20, 9:15 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Sun Jan 20, 2:53 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mark Junker, (Sat Jan 19, 4:39 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Sat Jan 19, 10:55 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Sat Jan 19, 5:17 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Fri Jan 18, 6:50 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Peter Karlsson, (Fri Jan 18, 11:30 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Thu Jan 17, 8:18 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 8:35 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Robin Rosenberg, (Thu Jan 17, 9:05 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 9:24 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Robin Rosenberg, (Fri Jan 18, 5:42 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Fri Jan 18, 6:30 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Peter Karlsson, (Fri Jan 18, 11:37 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Fri Jan 18, 4:49 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Theodore Tso, (Thu Jan 17, 3:01 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mark Junker, (Thu Jan 17, 2:50 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Thu Jan 17, 2:12 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Thu Jan 17, 2:18 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mark Junker, (Thu Jan 17, 2:36 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Thu Jan 17, 2:38 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 2:44 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Thu Jan 17, 3:02 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Dmitry Potapov, (Thu Jan 17, 5:27 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Thu Jan 17, 12:30 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Martin Langhoff, (Thu Jan 17, 12:51 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Thu Jan 17, 1:23 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Geert Bosch, (Thu Jan 17, 2:13 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Mitch Tishmack, (Thu Jan 17, 3:11 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Thu Jan 17, 6:22 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Thu Jan 17, 9:44 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Thu Jan 17, 11:57 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Thu Jan 17, 12:53 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Robin Rosenberg, (Thu Jan 17, 8:44 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Andrew Heybey, (Thu Jan 17, 10:02 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Thu Jan 17, 11:04 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kyle Moffett, (Sat Jan 19, 3:29 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Kevin Ballard, (Sat Jan 19, 3:57 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 8:25 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Wed Jan 16, 8:33 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 9:06 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Wed Jan 16, 8:43 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Wed Jan 16, 8:57 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, David Kastrup, (Wed Jan 16, 7:58 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Wed Jan 16, 8:19 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Eyvind Bernhardsen, (Wed Jan 16, 6:37 pm)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Jay Soffian, (Thu Jan 17, 12:43 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Linus Torvalds, (Thu Jan 17, 1:11 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Jay Soffian, (Thu Jan 17, 12:59 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Junio C Hamano, (Thu Jan 17, 1:15 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Thu Jan 17, 6:28 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Thu Jan 17, 7:10 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Pedro Melo, (Thu Jan 17, 7:23 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Thu Jan 17, 9:05 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Thu Jan 17, 7:51 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Johannes Schindelin, (Thu Jan 17, 8:53 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Thu Jan 17, 9:40 am)

Re: git on MacOSX and files with decomposed utf-8 file names, Wincent Colaiuta, (Thu Jan 17, 7:46 am)

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