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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1[Repost from -ports@]
As has been hashed out in -ports@ over the last few days there is at
least a need to examine weither or not the current ports system should
remain as is or potentially be re-engineered in the future (estimates
if and when needed vary from ASAP to 10-15 years). I have
volunteered to undertake a feasibility/pilot project to examine what
changes (if any) are needed in the system (for the purposes of this
thread I will not venture any of my own suggestions). I have the
following broad questions for people:1. What is more important to your personal use of FreeBSD (the ports
system, the underlaying OS, some other aspect)?2. How frequently do you interact with the ports systems and what is
the most common interaction you have with it?3. What is the single best aspect of the current system?
4. What is the single worst aspect of the current system?
5. If you where a new FreeBSD user how would your answers above
change? If you where brand new to UNIX how whould they change?6. Assuming that there was no additional work on your behalf would you
use a new system if it corrected your answer to number 4?7. Same as question 6 but for your answer on question 3?
8. How long have you used FreeBSD and/or UNIX in general?
9. That is your primary use(s) for your FreeBSD machine(s) (name upto 3)?
10. Assuming there is no functional difference what is your preferred
installation method for 3rd party software?11. On a scale from 1 to 10 (10 being the best) please rate the
importance of the following aspects of the ports system?a. User Interface
b. Consistency of behaviors and interactions
c. Accuracy in dependant port installations
d. Internal record keeping
e. Granularity's of the port management system12. Please rate your personal technical skill level?
- --
Aryeh M. Friedman
FloSoft Systems
Developer, not business, friendly
[ message continues ]
Automation and simplicity of the port installation procedure, granularity=20
a management and compilation time overhead when number of installed ports=20
are significant (for Desktops it's a waste of time and resources);
inability to keep only binary based installations due to lack of official=20
package updates between RELEASES;
very complicated and not automatic pkg-plist mechanism; =20
inability to forceably purge the configuration files;
inability to cross-architecture building;
inability to downgrade;
inability to predict download and installation volume for all the=20
dependencies even for binary installations;High
=2D-=20
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =20
=2D Best regards, Nikolay Pavlov. <<<----------------------------------- =
=20
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =20
pkg_add to cut install time, but usually ports tree because of missing
Medium.
Erik
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Installed ports are configurally very similar to the source distribution
(no renamed config files etc), so it's easy to get support from the
Average--
Andreas_______________________________________________
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Instead of asking all of the questions on a list, why not just
direct people to input information via a webpage? Seems to be a bit more
effective / less traffic than posting results to multiple lists..
-Garrett
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Mornin',
Instead of sending the filled in questionaire to the list why not
simply send it back to the original author as doubtlessly intended ...?;-)
Kind regards,
Patrick
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Tel. 0721 9109 0 * Fax 0721 9109 100
info@punkt.de http://www.punkt.de
Gf: Jürgen Egeling AG Mannheim 108285
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I strongly second that suggestion. There is far too much noise on some
of these lists as it is.Beech
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Beech Rintoul - FreeBSD Developer - beech@FreeBSD.org
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Software builds correct and is present. Including a way to make my own
Its source based and re-uses and existing language (make) instead of
Most ports don't deal well with multiple versions. Even apache which is
(that doesn't make sense -- if you corrected the single best aspect of
Desktop
Development (SVN, imap, you name it)
source compilation -- except for things like Xorg, Firefox and
Very High -- Professional System Admin_______________________________________________
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
Philip M. Gollucci (philip@ridecharge.com)
o:703.549.2050x206
Senior System Admin - Riderway, Inc.
http://riderway.com / http://ridecharge.com
1024D/EC88A0BF 0DE5 C55C 6BF3 B235 2DAB B89E 1324 9B4F EC88 A0BFWork like you don't need the money,
love like you'll never get hurt,
and dance like nobody's watching._______________________________________________
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Most of what I want to use is in there, and builds and installs without
A toss-up between
- inability to cross-build (not entirely fixable by ports, I
know, but I'm sure that *some* ports would be buildable with
appropriate cross-tools, and there's some chance that that set
would include the pieces I'm interested in...) and
- library dependencies don't extend to the base system. I've just spent a
week un-breaking my GNOME environment after upgrading to 7-STABLE from
6-STABLE (which worked, as did all my existing ports) and then
portupgrading (which broke nearly everything, because of the upgraded
system libc.so, libz.so and libpthread.so->libthr.so, resulting in
applications that depended on both old and new base libraries). A
corollary of this is that portupgrade -af is not restartable if
something breaks or requires manual intervention, which results inNo idea. I haven't been a new FreeBSD user for a long time. If I were a
new UNIX user, I might hope that things would work as they do in MacOS-X,
and probably would prefer to use a GUI interface to pre-built packages,
rather than the ports system at all. [That being the case, it's *most*Probably, but there are other aspects of ports that I like. I *like* that
it's made out of make, and can be coerced into doing things *my* way, with
little effort. At least I have the fall-back of using the NetBSD pkgsrc
system. It is mostly Ports with some additional sophistication forWorkstation (software dev.), production CVS/Perforce/Web server,
Competent.
Cheers,
--
Andrew
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In my experience, people from a Windoze background don't understand
dependencies at all. Everything "just happens" under the hood during
the install. This gives the impression that installing software works
better under Windoze, but this impression is false. Dependency bugs (in
the form of inconsistent/out-dated DLLs) have been a source of
However, to be acceptable, porting software into the build environment
as to be at least as easy as it is now. In fact, porting is far more
In the best of all possible worlds, installs would be self-contained
(they would install correctly on the target with no intervention from
the user). In the real world, I want 3rd party software to follow the
ports system (whatever it may be). If 3rd part software does NOT track_______________________________________________
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
This should read:
7. If the new system corrected the worst aspect of the current system
but broke the best aspect of it would you use the new system?
- --
Aryeh M. Friedman
FloSoft Systems
Developer, not business, friendly
http://www.flosoft-systems.com
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